competent

frederik said:
training doesnt show competency, bit of a catch 22 here. always will be.
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Probably legally training should form part of the package of competence. I still think that the assessed boys must have been trained by someone. There's no set law to state what format that training took and the fact that an industry body checked them for competence and then adopted them into their scheme should tell anyone with half a brain all they really need to know.
 
aom said:
Probably legally training should form part of the package of competence. I still think that the assessed boys must have been trained by someone. There's no set law to state what format that training took and the fact that an industry body checked them for competence and then adopted them into their scheme should tell anyone with half a brain all they really need to know.
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I had no training apart from what I learned off the old feckers I worked with, half of them are now dead and could not vouch for me. I attended the assessed route put some scaffold up and sat an open book test I received no instruction at all ( that said I have since worked with said instructor and believe he is the best in the UK JE )
 
The only thing they want to assess is how much you've got in your wallet to pay for the thing.
 
I'm only putting the argument across that I would use if I was in danger of losing my tickets. I know you didn't get training that weekend at the centre but you must have had training from someone even if it was the old hands but by passing the assessment you have proven that the old boys were great instructors.
 
If im a newbie working learning from working scaffs ,is that not training. DS working with a top man counts for something in my eyes. I had the same sort of instruction, working with top men.
 
Exactly, thought I was talking jockanese again. :laugh:
 
frederik said:
If im a newbie working learning from working scaffs ,is that not training. DS working with a top man counts for something in my eyes. I had the same sort of instruction, working with top men.
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I would like to yes but in my opinion I do not believe it would stand up in a court of law if you were using it as a defence although I personally learnt more off the old hands than what I did working for 4 years at a training centre
 
Fair enough Ian, I still think that they would be making a rod for their own back by trying to suggest that you could pass their checks with no training whatsoever. Doesn't say much for the rest of us. :eek:
 
Does anyone know of any cases of prosecution against un qualified men whose scaffold collapsed. I would say no, as the key word is competent, which includes you DS
 
I thought that the NVQ (QCF it's now called I think) is the qualification in scaffolding. The part 2 card shows you have been trained to a basic level. On the ofqual website the list of nationally recognized qualifications doesn't contain cisrs. It does contain NVQ and ecitb as qualifications. Why can't training be done in house. I know that virtually everything I know about scaffolding came from spending years working with some excellent scaffolders. If that's not classed as training and spending 2 weeks doing a course is I think is a shambles. Don't get me wrong I'm all for training. I have an apprentice that will be going to college to get qualified. But I can't understand for the life of me why you can't just do an assessment to get qualified. Under the rules of the QCF anyone can take any part of the assessment at any time. It is there to prove competence. If you don't pass the assessment you ain't competent and should do more training.Why should a man with 40 years experience in scaffolding say have to do a 2 week course with kids just starting out before he is even entered on to the QCF. For me it's not even about the cost. It's the length of the course that winds me up. My mate has only just done his part 2 after 20 years in scaffolding because he couldn't afford to have that much time of work. 1 month off work in 2 years is a big deal to him.
 
frederik said:
Does anyone know of any cases of prosecution against un qualified men whose scaffold collapsed. I would say no, as the key word is competent, which includes you DS
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No I haven't heard of any they will always go for the company. I know for a fact that the Milton Keynes collapse was run by a bloke who did not have any tickets he wasn't charged with feck all
 
If you want the nvq you need to do it using cisrs but you could do it in house if you could find a client who would accept it.
 
@Scaffy1980 Aye, that's part of the same thing; if the terminology is qualified rather than competent then it means you have to be trained and carded from them.
A guy that's been doing the job for twenty years without his cards is obviously competent, as it stands now, but he's not qualified.
 
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frederik said:
Milton keynes was an unusual series of events tho.
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Maybe from an outside perspective, but not to those who had actually worked for North Notts Scaffold , AKA Rablock, AKA Mansfield Scaffold AKA North Midlands Scaffold etc etc ;)
 
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