Ecitb scaffs tkt

ragscaff said:
Sorry Steve!

Phil181.

You state that CISRS can only be held because you have been trained!!

Maybe I should give my gold card back then, I have NVQ 3 & took the Assessed route of entry over two weekends. I have had no training in scaffolding as 80 - 90% of scaffolders who took this route over the ten year period.

ECITB were sold down the river when will the rest of us.

The SCCR is after answers to the situation & at the moment everone is saying nothing. This is not a dead loss issue & I am happy giving up my time to try & help others & makle sure there is someone else out there who can have an effect on our industry.

Next step scaffolders SKILLED LABOUR!!

Stewart Quinney
Chairman
SCCR
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Yes, I appreciate all that mate.

Don't shoot the messenger!
 
i have been watching this thread since the start and have never put my thoughts across. But i wish all you boys luck with all your endeavours with regards to getting your tickets or training sorted. like you all have said its not the ticket that makes the scaffolder its what is up top and what you can do with your hands. for you boys to be subjected to going back to part1 again is a disgrace. At bare minimum you should have an assesment for a couple of days or just use their common sense and just issue you with your cisrs cards for all the years of service you have put in. Wish you lads all the best
 
ragscaff said:
:push:If we are going to call it training lets make it training. When I did my advanced course I thought I would learn a bit more info. Far from it!!

I have been scaffolding over 20 years & am still learning. No help from training though. The whole system needs an overhaul!!

Ragscaff
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ditto, your spot on ragscaff,
 
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Ragscaff I have a Part 2 card CISRS and an ECITB Advanced card. I had the CISRS first but got the ECITB card when I seen how easy it was to get hold of and to be honest it has earned me some doh.. My question is before I go and pay for my own course, if this decesion does get turned around will I be awarded my advance card without having doing to do the course?
 
We are not asking for totally free & like for like cards.

What we are asking for is in two parts.

1/ A proper assesment of the scaffolders abilities so he can enter the scheme at the level they are experianced at.

2/ A training system that trains & is monitored better so quality training is across the country. An apprenticeship that is run with the company the guys are employed at. One years experiance enter training for part one, then another year enter training for part 2, 5 years minimum Advanced! Lets make this trade a skilled labour job.

Better wages etc more respect!!!

Rant over:rolleyes:

Ragscaff
 
make you right there ragscaff. Like i have been hearing the training needs a good in depth over haul
 
received the same leter as frenchy yesterday thomas 22 would be nice to no how many were sent out crazy yes your not competent and need trainning but you can scaffold
for another year lmfao!!!!!!
 
We have a year to get all scaffolders accessed at the level they are at :D
 
Wasn't scaffolding classed as a skill years ago then declassified for some reason?Beats me how a trade like ours,with all the training and regulations is still classed as unskilled.Never hear of brickies going on courses or joiners or being subjected to so much scrutiny as we are,is there a course for brickies putting up trestles?If scaffolding is unskilled why do we need all this training?It's about time something was done ,or do you think it's in the bosses interests to keep it unskilled to keep the pay rates down?
 
dangeruss said:
Don't have a great deal of faith in the NASC these days they seem to want to dictate what goes, how we should work, who we should work for,what tickets we should have.

It used to be the case that if you had started your scaffold training before 1996 you didn't need an NVQ your card would read "Industry accredited" on the back. One of our lads who started his training in 1989 went on his advanced course at Safety and Access in January ,he was told at Safety and Access he wouldn't need to do the dreaded portfolio, he sent off his ticket and was told the 1996 rule had changed and he had to fill in a portfolio and go back for an assesment costing a further £400, when we asked why the rule had changed we were told it was because the NASC had insisted on it.Yet again utter confusion right arm doesn't know what the left arms doing.

We tried to join the NASC and were told we couldn't because we had only been trading for 18 months and you need to be trading for 2 years so this in effect restricts our customer base who seem to think that if a company is NASC accredited all of the scaffolders are on the cards, with all the relevant tickets.Not the case at all in my experience.

I feel so sorry for the lads with ECITB cards if this is the way they are going to be treated. I would argue the case with the NASC that a scaffold ticket /card is not in fact a mandatory requirement in law however you must be a "compeitant person" to erect scaffolding/falsework ,competancy is measured using the following factors -Training ,Experience, Qualifications therefore if somebody has been a scaffolder for 15 years he has shown experience, if that person has also undergone various courses, inductions, on the job evaluations they have proved training, if that same person also has a valid ECITB card thats been accepted for the last 30 years that suggests qualifications .

I really can't see why the NASC and CISRS can't just say that if somebody fits the above criteria they can apply for a conversion/equivalent qualification and replace their old ECITB card with a new CISRC card. For a decent scaff to be sitting at home claiming the dole because of the pig headed attitude of an,lets face it advisory body like the NASC is a disgrace.

Can we not start some kind of petition and send it to the NASC and the CISRS ,after all if it wasn't for scaffolders and their companies paying into the NASC their wouldn't be an NASC and everybody would be happy.

Be free f**k the NASC
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i agree with all you are saying ,its about time that all the scaffolders got on the band wagon to fight the nasc and all there money making ideas. May i suggest you put up a poll (with a tick box) to gauge how much support is out there.(on the main page)
 
agree,its just a gang the amount of stipulations is disgraceful.there seems to be movement in the scaffolding world against them now companies are looking into the legalities of their consortium esp on 90%paye men on books.dont think the nasc is all bad but it has to become more inclusive and fast.
 
ragscaff said:
We are not asking for totally free & like for like cards.

What we are asking for is in two parts.

1/ A proper assesment of the scaffolders abilities so he can enter the scheme at the level they are experianced at.

2/ A training system that trains & is monitored better so quality training is across the country. An apprenticeship that is run with the company the guys are employed at. One years experiance enter training for part one, then another year enter training for part 2, 5 years minimum Advanced! Lets make this trade a skilled labour job.

Better wages etc more respect!!!

Rant over:rolleyes:

Ragscaff
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Ragscaff at the moment we have some apprentices who work for us on the cards. After 6 months they go on a course at the CITB for 2 weeks , all class room stuff with a bit of scaffolding but not much, they build a cube. After 1 year they are off again to the CITB for another 2 week course getting ready to do the part 1 , building towers etc. After 18 months they go and do the part 1. This is then repaeted again for the part 2. We have to pay for the advanced. from starting your apprenticeship to getting your part 2 it should take about 2 1/2 - 3 years depending on your apptitude. I have noticed that there now seem to be courses slipped inbetween the main courses i.e. outward bound probably to create more revenue to the training colleges but on the whole the lads coming back from the courses think they are good.
 
The question should be are the apprentices any better when they come back? Not really in my opinion.
 
The candidates have a better understanding of the theory that is never taught on site.
 
:amazed::amazed::amazed::amazed::lol,iv just found advance.im nvq level 3 on computers now.
 
steve gregory said:
The candidates have a better understanding of the theory that is never taught on site.
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Maybe Steve although 2 weeks ago I built a staircase up to the roof of one of the building at Weetabix with one of the apprentices , he came up the stairs and asked "why is the roof see through in places" he obviously didn't have a clue about sky lights on roofs, he hadn't been taught anything like that in a classroom , this is where experience takes over from classroom theory,although the risk assesment he had signed clearly stated there were sky lights on the roof, he just didn't like to ask what that meant !
 
steve gregory said:
The candidates have a better understanding of the theory that is never taught on site.
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may be on some sites steve but on most indusrial sites that ive been on its rammed down your neck courses new heath and safety rules ect any new regs that have came out ect ect not saying all mate because some dont care
capes spend thosands on trainning for there trainees and employees not a lot else though lol.
 
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