20 year old advanced scaffolder!

joebag said:
ok mate tell me this,what is the purpose of nasc,for the life of me i dont get it,

on one hand your telling me its optional-yet in real life its a closed book if your not in,

you have said its for guidance -yet your saying it takes no responsibility in the way lads are taught any of its recomendations ,,,,

what does it do apart from be parasitic and grow,i fail to see what benefit it is giving apart from to its members!
Click to expand...

What would be the point of joining if the members don't get anything out of it?

What is the difference between the NASC, the SCCR, or your local golf club?

All 3 organisations have a membership criteria for joining. The NASC is about as closed shop as the SCCR is. If you want to join then you can join - as long as you can fulfill it's membership criteria. Tell me where the difference is?

Maybe one difference is that the NASC has actually produced something that the industry as a whole can utilise if it wishes - member or not. Rather more helpful than just making petty insults on an internet forum. It doesn't even produce an annual safety report.

Some scaffolding orgainsation that!

The SCCR website is closed to non-members, good job the NASC's isn't, or nobody would be able to reference their website for snippets of info during one of these debates.

Who's elitist now?
 
you can see on another post i didnt join the sccr purely for the reason that ten pound is too much to some people and the website should be open,

why do you think phil that the only way forward is to attach a private organisation so close to a government body,on issues of safety this should be actively discouraged if not made illegal as vested interests can ultimately cost lives,

it shows the failings of nasc that people maybe do caomment wrong assumptions on here about them but they have made a rod for their own back as far as im concerned

their is enough money in this industry to fund all kinds of parasitic bodies so why not get the money better spent in different ways,alligning a lot closer with the hse,i for one think that an independent advisory body to the hse made up of old scaffold heads,engineers and other closely tied representatives would do far greater good for scaffolding than nasc ever could

make the cards legally compulsary,tie it in to the hse and give blokes a Shout at who directs their own industry and advises them how to stay safe,

i believe blokes would on a whole welcome safety issues even if it slowed the game down,as getting rid of parasites like nasc will free up the money that will even the balance,,,,,,same as everything wrong with britain at the mo too much middle management and people being scared into doing nothing!
 
joebag said:
you can see on another post i didnt join the sccr purely for the reason that ten pound is too much to some people and the website should be open,

why do you think phil that the only way forward is to attach a private organisation so close to a government body,on issues of safety this should be actively discouraged if not made illegal as vested interests can ultimately cost lives,

it shows the failings of nasc that people maybe do caomment wrong assumptions on here about them but they have made a rod for their own back as far as im concerned

their is enough money in this industry to fund all kinds of parasitic bodies so why not get the money better spent in different ways,alligning a lot closer with the hse,i for one think that an independent advisory body to the hse made up of old scaffold heads,engineers and other closely tied representatives would do far greater good for scaffolding than nasc ever could

make the cards legally compulsary,tie it in to the hse and give blokes a Shout at who directs their own industry and advises them how to stay safe,

i believe blokes would on a whole welcome safety issues even if it slowed the game down,as getting rid of parasites like nasc will free up the money that will even the balance,,,,,,same as everything wrong with britain at the mo too much middle management and people being scared into doing nothing!
Click to expand...

So who picks this advisory body?

Nice idea mate, but we'd all just be moaning about them, rather than the NASC.

This would also have to be funded somehow, who would pay for that - the HSE? If they did, you'd surely have at least 25% of the comittee made up of HSE personnel.

That would destroy our industry.
 
phil i can take turning up at a site and not being allowed on because the government through a card system says no,,,i couldnt take a private volunteer non profit vegan dungaree wearing body such as nasc telling me i cant earn my family money,,,,

its not right and this body is along with others holding scaffolders to account,so in return they will be held to account in the same regard,,,,,i might not have all the info on how nasc works yet but by putting it out their people do come together and for better or worse it will come out how sincere this body is,,,,,and as i say i will hold my hand up if im wrong but to be honest mate i dont think i am!

on the front page of its website it has got a heading stipulates only nasc then a list of contractors councils etc that only use nasc members,,,

thats fear and pressure for their own ends and your telling me this body is non profit,,,,well id like to see their expenses account for one !
 
joebag said:
phil i can take turning up at a site and not being allowed on because the government through a card system says no,,,i couldnt take a private volunteer non profit vegan dungaree wearing body such as nasc telling me i cant earn my family money,,,,

its not right and this body is along with others holding scaffolders to account,so in return they will be held to account in the same regard,,,,,i might not have all the info on how nasc works yet but by putting it out their people do come together and for better or worse it will come out how sincere this body is,,,,,and as i say i will hold my hand up if im wrong but to be honest mate i dont think i am!

on the front page of its website it has got a heading stipulates only nasc then a list of contractors councils etc that only use nasc members,,,

thats fear and pressure for their own ends and your telling me this body is non profit,,,,well id like to see their expenses account for one !
Click to expand...

Why don't you download their account reports from companies house?

It's only a quid.
 
will do,but its not going to tell me everything is it,for a nonprofit organisation its extremely aggresive in getting its market share,it just doesnt add up to me and rumours of ties to system scaffold and other conflicts of interest will persist until it either takes over completely, implodes itself,treats scaffolders as a whole with respect or another body rivals it(which unless its totally independent i dont want to see),

would be interesting to here from outfits who have been thrown out of nasc and for what reasons though ?
 
joebag said:
will do,but its not going to tell me everything is it,for a nonprofit organisation its extremely aggresive in getting its market share,it just doesnt add up to me and rumours of ties to system scaffold and other conflicts of interest will persist until it either takes over completely, implodes itself,treats scaffolders as a whole with respect or another body rivals it(which unless its totally independent i dont want to see),

would be interesting to here from outfits who have been thrown out of nasc and for what reasons though ?
Click to expand...

Well one of the biggest scaffolding contractors in the UK got thrown out last November for breaking a rule - so hardly the closed shop a few individuals are making it out to be.

As for having a 'totally independent' trade body then, that is impossible unless it is government appointed, which, as I've pointed out before, would be a disaster for the scaffolding industry.
 
why would it be a disaster phil,im not one for no regulation as i believe we need to be kept in check,admittedly the government can fook things up but if you want regulation then surely thats the way to go,non profit bodies are never that,,,,,,fully independent bodies that sign up to a no clash of interest contract are so much more transparrent!
 
joebag said:
why would it be a disaster phil,im not one for no regulation as i believe we need to be kept in check,admittedly the government can fook things up but if you want regulation then surely thats the way to go,non profit bodies are never that,,,,,,fully independent bodies that sign up to a no clash of interest contract are so much more transparrent!
Click to expand...

Yeah maybe mate.

Anyway, I better do some work!

You've been a worthy adversary, I look forward to continuing this debate another time.
 
In constuction news report I see the nasc are in the proccess of persuading hse to change wording competent to qualified. That is in the nasc interests only. Me thinks something to do with their courses. Nice if you have a powerfull ear to bend.
 
its the little things that add up to the big shock,why would nasc be interested in this if its not making profits or getting something out of it,

i think they are angling to break down all the training into totally seperate cards for each system and them and their members pushing tube out the market ,

will still be used on some jobs but as a whole they can then stick "Qualified" 2 day course lads building the forth bridge !
 
After reading some of the comments on here regarding training i would agree with 90%. The hole system needs to change with regards training the problem is CISRS, NASC, NVQ,OFSTED,HSE and the training providers. As you see joebag the instructors are bottom of the pile and do what there are told by all the above. As stated many times we are 30 years behind the times when it comes to what we as an industry should be doing to train are young scaffolders for the future.
 
theirs ***** scaffs,***** instructors ,***** suppliers etc etc but if the people at the top and ones who make the regs are ***** ,which it seems to be at the moment we are all fooked,

to be this bad takes skill and its not a conspiracy i just genuinely believe old fashioned greed is at the centre of it all,not a problem in business,,

,a huge problem when your dealing with blokes lives and livelyhoods !
 
scaffold training in the U k between all the trainng provider has a £6 million + turnover,I hope this answers you question joebag.
 
Thats The Answer I Was About To Give John, Maybe The Kids Really Really Good, And Is Marked Out For Management, Never Can Tell Joe Could Be The Case.
 
I have been an instructor for over 7 years and in that time i have come across 3 x 20 to 23 year old good advance scaffolders.Remember joebag some of the boys 20 years a go done a hole year a bircham and that process produce some of the best young scaffolders every at the age 20.
 
its not a case of the good old days but have you seen the state of the ***** thats twenty years of age now,its all x factor and hair straighteners lol

,seriously though it used to be risk = reward,you learnt a lot from near misses and mistakes,

now that process has been taken away you have to rely on training,,,,and the training is not only woefull its actually designeg to make money rather than scaffolders !
 
well said joe

thats me 35 years a go done a hole year a bircham and that process produce some of the best young scaffolders every at the age 18.

i was made foreman 1 year after i left then supervisor 2 years after i left bircham, but i was put with the best scaffs in teesside
and they made me sweat blood to get there respect.

i think training now is over rated.

its what you learn on sites that makes you a scaff.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom