Crippled Scaffolders

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ragscaff said:
Without going into the full detail of what was spoke about. The main issue on the wear & tear is the distance you step to top hand rail, the issue in question was the step up with out ladder in that instance. We brought up several issues with this system & the talks on this subject went on for some time.

I am not geting drawn into a wasted debate on this issue with a person who just wants to be negative. As I have posted, bullet point notes from the meeting will be placed on the SCCR page with full minutes on the SCCR site.

The issues were welcomed as possitive input & more work between the two parties is being done on this issue.

Stewart Quinney
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Negative???

Erm. Here's me promoting the scaffstep and the principles that support it's use and I am being negative? (Well that's what a safety bloke would do isn't it?!) - FIRST time in my life anyone has called me negative. Well done you.

My belief is well and truly beggared.
 
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Fatguy "FIRST time in my life anyone has called me negative. Well done you"

what do they normally call you then mate ??

The link you put up to the HSE site deals with the laying down of a rescued casualty as is the normal first aid response.As oposed to some advice to keep the casualty in a sitting position after rescue.It was published in 2008

It does not deal with the issues of blood pooling in the legs of an unconcious casualty due to the muscles not being active and the tightening effect of the harness itself on the upper thighs nor the effects of shock or other injuries the person sustained in the fall.

You appear to think that a guy can fall from height,be arrested from the fall by his harness 4m down and suffer no other injuries apart from a tendency to faint if left suspended.

Fainting is a natural response to truama,the body will drop and lay in a verticle position to enable an increased blood flow to the brain without extra strain on the heart.The person who has fainted will usually regain conciousness within a few minutes.

When suspended in a verticle position the body cannot do this with a result that the brain could be starved of oxygen.There is also a risk of blood clots forming in the deep veins of the legs (DVT) creating thier own problems added to the release of the built up toxins carried in the blood.

Far from "pooped" to my mind
 
my right shoulder goes dead when im driving. whats all that about. time to get off of spanners altogether i think
 
Rigger said:
Fatguy "FIRST time in my life anyone has called me negative. Well done you"

what do they normally call you then mate ??

The link you put up to the HSE site deals with the laying down of a rescued casualty as is the normal first aid response.As oposed to some advice to keep the casualty in a sitting position after rescue.It was published in 2008

It does not deal with the issues of blood pooling in the legs of an unconcious casualty due to the muscles not being active and the tightening effect of the harness itself on the upper thighs nor the effects of shock or other injuries the person sustained in the fall.

You appear to think that a guy can fall from height,be arrested from the fall by his harness 4m down and suffer no other injuries apart from a tendency to faint if left suspended.

Fainting is a natural response to truama,the body will drop and lay in a verticle position to enable an increased blood flow to the brain without extra strain on the heart.The person who has fainted will usually regain conciousness within a few minutes.

When suspended in a verticle position the body cannot do this with a result that the brain could be starved of oxygen.There is also a risk of blood clots forming in the deep veins of the legs (DVT) creating thier own problems added to the release of the built up toxins carried in the blood.

Far from "pooped" to my mind
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They call me Fat Guy. That's my name.

As they say, 'my work here is done.'

I am not getting into a bun fight - I am too busy for that. I appreciate your putting words into my mouth and misquoting me. I don't recall saying all of the effects you quoted were pooped, just one, suspension trauma. Equally, I don't recall saying timely rescue wasn't essential, but hey, what are a few words between cyber buddies?

The effects you mention support the idea of FAE being a last resort, hence the reason for attempting to lessen the amount of time relying upon it. That would mean using such glorious inventions as AG's and other similar systems - the very items that a very very small minority of UK Scaffolders are so vehemently opposed to because, and I quote, 'they cripple Scaffolders'.
 
Fat Guy, I don't think anyone said the scaffstep cripples scaffolders. The origional post in the thread asked, ,< would it cripple scaffolders > Your opinion is that it wont and your not moving from that. The fact is as its relatively new nobody can say for certain. We are not medical men and as its relatively new no research has been done on the issue. I think that was the point of the question. I do not doubt your knowledge and experience in the H'S.field, but sometimes we are blinkered in our views an I include myself as a scaffolder in that. My answer to the question is, I don't know, It might depend on age, fitness levels etc, or as been suggested repetetive strain on the knees, so why not let it be monitored over a period and let the expert medical people pass a judgement on it. Regards Brandy.
 
brandy said:
Fat Guy, I don't think anyone said the scaffstep cripples scaffolders. The origional post in the thread asked, ,< would it cripple scaffolders > Your opinion is that it wont and your not moving from that. The fact is as its relatively new nobody can say for certain. We are not medical men and as its relatively new no research has been done on the issue. I think that was the point of the question. I do not doubt your knowledge and experience in the H'S.field, but sometimes we are blinkered in our views an I include myself as a scaffolder in that. My answer to the question is, I don't know, It might depend on age, fitness levels etc, or as been suggested repetetive strain on the knees, so why not let it be monitored over a period and let the expert medical people pass a judgement on it. Regards Brandy.
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We were using steps at Lyndon 6 years ago and they've got 100's of lads been using them for years and still using them now without any problems as far as i am aware?

FFS i thought this was toughest game in the world - this argument does seem a bit weak for a trade humping tons of gear around every day in the cold wet arse end of nowhere!

get a grip fellas!:bigsmile:
 
TaffScaff72 said:
We were using steps at Lyndon 6 years ago and they've got 100's of lads been using them for years and still using them now without any problems as far as i am aware?

FFS i thought this was toughest game in the world - this argument does seem a bit weak for a trade humping tons of gear around every day in the cold wet arse end of nowhere!

get a grip fellas!:bigsmile:
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If no ones monitoring the scaffolders health then issues wont arise. With regards to it being one of the toughest trades I agree but that doesn't mean a scaffolder should end up in ill health.
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thefatguy you have some valid points of view but just because others have a different point of view theres no need to spit the dummy out. If you've been in the industry that long you will realise there are a lot of grey areas where companies cannot fully comply with the guidelines.
 
During the meeting with the SCCR and the HSE it was talked about fatigue and the excess wear and tear on the scaffolders body due to all the extra weight the scaffolder is carrying these days.
The reply from the HSE and Simon Hughes(who wrote SG4-10)was NO RESEARCH had been carried out on this and caused a major concern to the HSE. This subject is now going to be researched and as we are so close to the grand opening of SG4-10 (27th NOV 2010 with a revision every 5 years ) we should have all this information prior to SG4-15.
XXIANXX raised a valued point on this issue and rest assured THIS HAS NOW BEEN NOTICED.
 
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Is this a sign that scaffold companies have to take serious note of the manual handling regs !!! scaffolder`s are always at the bottom of the chain
 
i been using two milk crates on top of each other all my scaffolding days for 8 foot lifts or high base outs , aint done me any harm :)
 
XxIANxX said:
If no ones monitoring the scaffolders health then issues wont arise. With regards to it being one of the toughest trades I agree but that doesn't mean a scaffolder should end up in ill health.
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thefatguy you have some valid points of view but just because others have a different point of view theres no need to spit the dummy out. If you've been in the industry that long you will realise there are a lot of grey areas where companies cannot fully comply with the guidelines.
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My feeling is that there is nothing wrong with the step and will not do you any harm as long as you follow the instructions , as for monitoring I am all for it, what needs to happen is to lose the rope and wheel and handballing in favour of scaffold hoist ( one which is suitable for tube and fitting not just system that we the scaffolders can erect), light gauge tube being the only option when buying new thus over years phasing out
the old stuff (for those who have not used the light stuff a 21' is like a 16') and as daft as it sounds rotate which hand you turn your spanner with and shoulder which you carry gear with .
 
You can,t beat a BOKA hoist for the 10 to 20 lifts,as for the alloy steps its a step in the wrong direction as far as the over 40s are concerned i.e wear n tear on the old chips and peas. ;)
 
Joe90 said:
You can,t beat a BOKA hoist for the 10 to 20 lifts,as for the alloy steps its a step in the wrong direction as far as the over 40s are concerned i.e wear n tear on the old chips and peas. ;)
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c'mon joe my dads 59 next month ...fit as a butchers dog :)
 
Scaffolding is a way of life not a carier, just embrace the pain it comes with the turff!!
 
steve gregory said:
During the meeting with the SCCR and the HSE it was talked about fatigue and the excess wear and tear on the scaffolders body due to all the extra weight the scaffolder is carrying these days.
The reply from the HSE and Simon Hughes(who wrote SG4-10)was NO RESEARCH had been carried out on this and caused a major concern to the HSE. This subject is now going to be researched and as we are so close to the grand opening of SG4-10 (27th NOV 2010 with a revision every 5 years ) we should have all this information prior to SG4-15.
XXIANXX raised a valued point on this issue and rest assured THIS HAS NOW BEEN NOTICED.
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Lol, about time too. so far i've had roughly about 17 broken bones(from fingers to ribs and ankles) have problems with my back, knees, wrists and a fecked rotator cuff in my right shoulder, thats not counting the hearing damage that i've never noticed researched mainly caused by banging pins an cups for 20 years.

But then again, what other job can give you a laugh like this one
 
Don't mention rotator cuff, had mine repaired in jan 2010 back to work in april (against doctors whishes) now think I might of torn it again lifting 8m f*****g beam. Not going to have any moore ops just gotta get with it. Ps Strongbow best pain killer
 
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