COTs

  • Thread starter southernpoofter
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As stated above that would be down to being able to prove competence and that the training had sufficient content. At the end of the day it would be a court judge who would decide over that in the event of a claim etc etc. With regards to CSCS cards and SSSMS I wouldn't deem these qualifications for health and safety advice/ training .
 
I would stand up in any court in the land with photos, references and statements from fellow scaffs to prove my competence, I would then show the flaws in the whole card system and I guarantee you the judge would see how fair balanced and competent a tradesmen I was......theres nothing to fear but fear itself......how ingrained in us is the fear of the unknown. ...bring it on I say!
 
batm said:
So I do not see the problem offering a course, the problem is forcing everyone to do it when it is not needed.

Regards Stewart
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It is solely your choice to decide whether the course is required , if you don't want to put your operatives on the course then that's down to you. The fact that this course has been rolled out means that your customers will be asking for details of your employees having been on the course. If you can supply them with an alternative that they will accept then all the better for you.
What all scaffold contractors should do is start asking their contractors what training requirements they expect, then start adding ££s to their bill for anything CISRS/NASC related this is the only way to get the message across.:)
 
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Well its not a choice because CISRS is wanted by the client.

You cannot get a ticket without COTS now & current guys have to undertake this one day course so it is forced.


Stewart
 
No ones forcing you to do anything , same has cisrs is a business and its up to them how they structure their card system. There is nothing in this world stopping you setting up your own training system , the hard bit will be getting your clients on board. At the end of the day if your client wants the COTs card its up to you to say ok or walk away. That's Business !!!!
 
thank god I am now retired from all this crap,like someone said the game is on its knees,i have said many times on here you learn the game on the job not sat in a fecking classroom.
 
Mandatory in CISRS eyes , but there is nothing in any HSE guidance that states you require a CISRS card to erect scaffolding. You do require to be trained and competent and if you can prove this then your good to go out and put up scaffold.
The problem you have is that NASC and CISRS have brainwashed your clients into believing that they are the only people that can provide that training and that they should make sure you are carrying one of their training cards. How ever sh1t you think that is you have got to admit it's damn good marketing
 
Did they change the regs to read trained & competent I thought it was just competent.

I know the SG reads trained & competent but as you said this is the wording from CISRS.

Yes good marketing & will probably never change as too many main clients are now involved. No card do not come on site.

Mind you we have managed to get trainees on Midas sites with copies of our training Matrix, & yes we were able to do the work without being an NASC firm so you never know.

Stewart
 
That in my opinion is the only way forward. Approaching the client and explaining how he has been brainwashed by NASC/ CISRS. Tell them there is nothing in the wah regs or the haswa that states you require a CISRS card to erect scaffold and that you put your employees through a more demanding training programme in house.
 
aom said:
I think this was pushed by the UKCG to make sure anyone on site had a minimum level of knowledge and understanding of risk. I have done nothing about it yet but I do know you can do this in house and is probably our preferred way of dealing with it.
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you ok allistar way things going the in house certificates for courses are going if not gone ive got certificate indoors for scaffold inspections which has citb recognised all over it but its not worth the paper its written on all scaffolds on our firm need to be cisrs scaffold inspector certificated on our firm now otherwise you cannot sighn scaffolds off our firm putting 10 of us throw before xmas it will soon be the slinger tickets as with any other in house certificate that haven't got cisrs on them.its a kick in the balls for small firms that don't have the thosands like the bigger firms the bubbles got to burst soon it just cant keep going on
 
I know what you mean Kev but once again I see it from the other side. I invest quite heavily at a cost to train men as I see it right.

I went on a job the other day that the builders in-house scaffs couldn't do. It was simple enough to do but when I went to the office and he showed me the certificates he had for his men I realised why they couldn't scaffold a phone box.

Some diddy is travelling about my area training labourers to erect system in 1 day and is certifying his own work. It takes me about 18 months before I can get someone on to a product course.

Who is right and who is wrong?

As for the COTS, get a few bodies together SP, get the training notes and I will come down and deliver it myself, will be good practice for me.;)
 
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