PAYE, CIS or Umbrella - Straw Poll please Gents?

one way said:
no your job pays my commission we get a wage plus commission we work like dogs to get you guys out its not easy calling all the companies a lot of rejection involved i'd say we work just as hard if not harder then you guys
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work liek dogs hey. Nice warm office coffee by the kettle load warm dinners ? Dogs you say slogging it out in all weather knee deep in sodding mud lumping tubes about all day and getting it up ill give you 10min in the cahin gangs with 20's if you on commission were does you wages come from???? Work harded than us shut the fek up and put your self forwud for a days graft as a scaffs lab you wouldnt last till 10,
 
We ask for cv and 2 refs so we can see the type of work you do we don't want station lads on the streets as we find them on the phone all day looking for better money on the stations, we also look at your cv to gain info who's working where for future sales calls and if your not getting paid what the add says ask them to text you the job details and rate of pay then legally they gave to pay you that rate

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If an agency pays paye we have to pay ni and holiday pay that's why we only do self employed or umbrella

---------- Post added at 12:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:47 AM ----------
SWIFTY said:
A lot of rejection? I can feel my eyes filling up for you.
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marra watson said:
work liek dogs hey. Nice warm office coffee by the kettle load warm dinners ? Dogs you say slogging it out in all weather knee deep in sodding mud lumping tubes about all day and getting it up ill give you 10min in the cahin gangs with 20's if you on commission were does you wages come from???? Work harded than us shut the fek up and put your self forwud for a days graft as a scaffs lab you wouldnt last till 10,
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I think you need to go on reed and read up on recruitment
 
As I presume you may have surmised, I never have, nor ever will use an agency as I refuse to facilitate an eejit like yourself, with delusions of granduer for 'giving me work'. I can and will get my own work. It's just a shame that more don't realise that they don't need to legitimise agencies' place in the industry. The fact is, if the worker's don't use them then there is no 'recruitment' business. Wishful thinking, I know. SCCR, where do you stand on this? The scaffolding proletariat await your response.
 
Sorry pal scaffs don't always have choice nowadays companies want to use agencies no commitment I can use you for 8 hours and get rid of you no holiday pay no ni
 
I know this. I'm sure I alluded to the fact in my first post to you on this topic. My point is, most don't, or don't give a ****. To be honest, I'm increasingly disillusioned with the whole industry. Workers either don't have the common sense or the back bone to stand up and be counted and fight for their rights. They do have a 'choice' though. The problem is that, in these austere times, principles go out of the window.
 
one way said:
Sorry pal scaffs don't always have choice nowadays companies want to use agencies no commitment I can use you for 8 hours and get rid of you no holiday pay no ni
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At least he's honest !
It should be PAYE with holiday pay and every thing else and it should be enforced ,that way its a level playing field.
I would do my utmost to keep away from agencies.
As a foot note to make 3 pound an hour on a man is not bad ,you have 20 scaffs working so its 60 pound an hour.
 
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Mike Mann said:
I am pricing some tenders for hiring scaffolders and would like to ask the Forum what the general consensus is for what is the most popular method of taxation for doing a temporary agency assignment:

1/ PAYE
2/ CIS
3/ Umbrella

They all have pros & cons and each have different cost implications for the Employer/Agent.

Any sensible comments would be welcome...
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I prefer CIS (self employed).
 
nick59 said:
At least he's honest !
It should be PAYE with holiday pay and every thing else and it should be enforced ,that way its a level playing field.
I would do my utmost to keep away agencies.
As a foot note to make 3 pound an hour on a man is not bad ,you have 20 scaffs working so its 60 pound an hour.
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I am no mathamatician but if you had 200 scaffs working for you its 600 pound a hour.
 
SCCR's opinion on agencies?
We toyed with the idea of a scaffolder's agency, non profit run to cover just administration costs giving the rest to the guy actually doing the job.
To be honest we don't have the resources (Forgive the pun) to manage something like this.

If any member feels he is capable of getting something like this off the ground then please contact us.

One way I like your honesty.
 
Agencies .scum.the biggest blight on the insustry since giving people with 3 years experience a gold card.(but the Comedy cisrs system is another subject)shame there's not any organisations out there that could put up a fight for the worker.united we stand etc.agencies you're like a radio Dj hanging around a children's ward.scum
 
Gentlemen thanks for participating in the straw poll on PAYE/CIS/Umbrella implications in the employment of Scaffolders. Thanks for those contributing and the results are as follows:

6 for PAYE
5 for CIS
1 for Cash in Hand
3 no agencies please
1 for Umbrella (vote came from an agent)

I think it is clear that most scaffolders prefer PAYE or CIS and loathe using Umbrella companies based on the fact that they are persuaded to use them by agents. Agents pay their temps using the Umbrella method in order to keep costs down and be more competitive to their end user. The Umbrella method also means the tax man loses out and ultimately all of our shared public services.

If you are looking to point the finger of blame here I think it lies with the over regulation or hiring/firing that comes from Brussels and makes it difficult for scaffolding companies to take on employees. The other lazy jane here is the HMRC that has dropped the ball on controlling tax in the construction industry – bring back SC60 & 714’s!

Observations from members are that recruitment agents need to brush up on their customer service skills as they obviously have a poor reputation on the Forum. We also need to get out from behind our desks (me included) and get out on site as you cannot provide a decent level of service to the industry unless you are in the field. Agents need to understand who their customers are.

There were interesting points made by stonedrose1 & Swifty concerning the lack the pay regulation in the labour market. I don’t think we can get away from the free market nature of having bosses (Bourgeoisie) behind desks and workers (Proletariat) out of site doing the hard work. If you want to resolve this see Das Kapital for further reading on the proposal that the motivating force of capitalism is the exploitation of labour:

Das Kapital - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The industry would benefit from some kind of employment regulations. EG the Electricians are regulated by the JIB which are very effective at negotiating pay and conditions and have a very modern approach to Industrial Relations.

Maybe someone should set up a non-for-profit agency for scaffolders as swifty suggests? Within the electrical industry there was ESCA which was run by the JIB. It had a good name with electricians and electrical contractors alike but sadly it was pushed out of the market by its competitors. Maybe there is someone out there that can do this?
 
worked for agencies for last 5 years and all companies pay through umbrella firms where you pay an admin fee. cis deduct 20% and PAYE can pay you at a minimum wage and the rest as expenses so your net pay is the same.
 
I'm not bothered, as long as it gets paid and its in my bank. Sometimes its hard enough to get paid from a direct boss never mind throwing another person into the mix who tries to pass on some bullsh*t excuse and you end up chasing money for months! Why do companies not just subby guys direct anymore?? I thought that was what the CIS 4 was for??
 
Excellent post Mike.
Not sure about sitting down to Marx's lecture.
 
one way said:
Sorry pal scaffs don't always have choice nowadays companies want to use agencies no commitment I can use you for 8 hours and get rid of you no holiday pay no ni
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You're a nasty piece of work. Just like the other guy I met recently from an 'umbrella' company. Both show their true faces under pressure.
 
I hate agencies and umbrella schemes ,
There's a storm coming, and You and your friends better batten down the hatches, because when it hits, you're all gonna wonder how you ever thought you could live so large and leave so little for the rest of us!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Scum
 
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